[CarlSW]

>> Name one case where a Christian has mistreated a individual because of their sin, yes we are all sinners and in need of a Saviour.

Well 'heretics' were tortured by Protestants and Catholics alike. There are Christian parents who beat a child to death and then say they were posessed, there was a case where an 'excorsism' resulted in death quite recently.

>> You're making an overstated generalization, the issue is not where a Christian likes homosexuality or not, to a Christian the issue is what God says, not the individual, its not for me to say whether or not homosexuality is wrong, as it is also not for me to say whether or not stealing is wrong, its for God to state it

Well say it or don't say it, that's fine by me. If anyone speaks rudely or arrogantly or with some enjoyment of counting the faults of others, they are open to Paul's observations in 1 Cor 13, or other responses that are appropriate to the manner and content of what was said.

>> Well okay, the issue is about for a Christian's prespective how this will affect us, our freedoms to practice our faith outside the confines of a Church meeting, how this will affect Charities etc, this has nothing to do with only emotional aspects but practical aspects of having the freedoms to practice what we are obligated to obey.

Ok. When handing out food in a soup kitchen, what could possibly get in the way of charitably handing out food in the soup kitchen? If someone doesn't want to talk about religion, what's so hard about saying "ok, well here's the soup"

IF what someone is about is simply being charitable, and/or IF what they are about is simply saying what they understand to be the truth to people who are interested, then I don't see any problem and I don't think most juries would see a problem, and I don't think there is a legal problem.

IF what someone is about is pressuring people who don't want to be pressured, THEN there are questions of harassment.

>> ok you just made a generalization, first and foremost we are forbidden as believers to bear false witness against another, what Christian is spreading false rumours against any individual homosexual ????

There are people who talk about homosexuality or about gay people, so sloppily, and so nastily, I could characterize it as slander, lies, etc. There are people compare homosexuals to pedophiles or to people whoa re into bestiality, either implying or directly stating that these things go together, as if gay people were mroe likely to be sexual predators or whatnot. To mouth off like that is a DISREGARD for truth, NOT a high regard for truth. If you don't seek truth, you aren't likely to find it, and in any case, not caring about truth doesn't sound very Christian to me. If someone cared enough for truth to look into evidence, they'd find that someone being gay is a different issue than someone being a sexual predator or bestiophile, the evidence does not suggest any causal link.

>> Again to a Christian it's not simply about just having a moral dissagreement, its about what God said not what I think.

Then it is a lack of faith and humility that many Christians are dealing with, if they get so frustrated about getting God's word out, as if their personal frustration were God's frustration, as if God was at a loss without their moral speaches.

>> The issue is that the Gay rights groups are at war with the God of the Bible, the soul aim is to remove the bible alltogether as this has happend in Canada.

That's a lot of assumptions and pretty general.

Exactly what about the gay rights movement are you talking about. There are people who want their own church to marry homosexuals, yes. But there are many others who are not trying in any way to change whether a church marries homosexuals. And there are even a lot of gay people who are concerned for gay rights, who aren't interested in gay marriage. And others who are only concerned that hospital visitation and inheritance laws are fair towards homosexuals.

I don't see any gay rights movement trying to take the Bible out of your church or home.

>> The issue is what the God of the Bible thinks of this issue, again not what I think.

But I'm not sure what you are saying.

If you are saying that in general gay rights is about sin and law, well I understand what you are saying.

But the law DOES protect sinners. Vigilantes can't just go out and lynch everyone who they think is having sex out of wedlock.

>> Under God Christians are not to compromise his moral position on this issue, for example a Christian can sell books to homosexuals, but God dose not allow two homosexual men to sleep in the bed together, and to marry etc.

So what's the problem? If you want to marry people, become a pastor in a church that doesn't believe in marrying gay people. If you want to run a christian-only bed and breakfast, don't advertise in the public telephone directory, advertize only to Christians as a Christian thing.

What are you wanting to refuse? By what actions do you think Christians must be able to refuse to endorse something?

There's plenty of hotels down the street from me that will take in unmarried heterosexuals all the time. If no one's getting beaten or killed or raped, if it's consentual adults, their business is renting the room, literally that IS their business. If someone wanted to rent only to conservative Christian couples, why advertize to the general public?

>> The Bible is our guide book, it tell us how to live, treat others, to love in the way we obey God, to bare witness to the truth.

Some people take it to say that homosexuals should be put to death today, by today's governments.

The governments of the free world aren't about to do that, but there are Arabic countries who are willing to do it.

>> I believe that the goverment should not be involved in religous issues, or these issues, but Jesus said to be seperate to this world view and have a Christ Centered world view, Jesus said do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind.

Rights have a lot to do with the government not treating people unfairly, and public businesses not misusing their power.

Sometimes people in the world hate others because of injustice, unfairness, things like that, though. Claims of persecution aren't an excuse, whether they are quotes from Jesus or anyone else.